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Report 860
Report #860 Skillset: Combat Skill: KeenEye Org: Harbingers Status: Completed Jun 2012 Furies' Decision: We will look into implementing solution 3. Problem: Keeneye has recently been adjusted to work with Stag Antlers - however, it does not work with many other similar poison-application abilities. This report seeks to address a perceived imbalance here. A (hopefully) comprehensive list of the affected abilities will be presented in the comments. 0 R: 0 Solution #1: Give keeneye messages for all abilities that inflict poisons (regardless of how or when). 0 R: 0 Solution #2: Give keeneye messages for those poison abilities inflicted directly (not those that act passively - such as Blacktalon Spiders - or on the victim's triggering them - such as Tracking/Cooking). 0 R: 0 Solution #3: Give keeneye messages for those poison abilities that require poisons to be applied from vials/the liquidrift (e.g. Stealth Darts, Ecology Fetish) rather than those that are inherently poisonous (e.g. Transmology Claws, Nihilism Barbedtail). Player Comments: ---on 6/3 @ 23:30 writes: The hopefully comprehensive list of poison-giving abilities: Ecology Fetish, Ecology FamiliarSting, Beastmastery Spit, Transmology Claws, Nekotai Sprongcree, Nekotai ScorpionSpit, Stealth Blowgun, Tracking Spikepit, Tracking Darts, Nihilism Barbedtail, Blacktalon Spiders, Shamanism Frogs, Cooking Death, Cooking Botulism, Cooking Sleep, Telekinesis AnimateDagger. ---on 6/3 @ 23:30 writes: Please make suggestions for alternative solutions, raise issues with those presented, or (perhaps most importantly) give additions/modifications for the above list of abilities. :) ---on 6/6 @ 13:18 writes: I don't feel that this is necessary for most of these skills. Stag Antlers have a chance to inflict with a poison, if I am correct. Fetish, spit, claws, sprongcree, barbedtail, etc. They all are guaranteed to hit with the poison. Keeneye doesn't tell you if they shrugged, does it? If it did that, I'd be fine with this report. Otherwise, it just seems to be adding an unnecessary (and already known) line to combat. ---on 6/6 @ 13:36 writes: Keeneye was changed to inform the user if the poison took effect. For antlers it has this sort of output: "With your keen eye, you notice that escozul from your antlers has poisoned Kelly." I support Solution 2, yes to active (single target) things like ScorpSpit, Blowgun (if in same room), Claws, Barbedtail - No to things like Animate Dagger (out of room), Cooking poisons, demesne passives. ---on 6/6 @ 19:51 writes: I like solution 2 ---on 6/6 @ 22:04 writes: I like solution 2 over any of the other solutions, but I am not 100% sure that this report is needed. Is the ability to see what poison Stag Antlers do giving Stag users an easier time then their counterparts? ---on 6/6 @ 22:18 writes: I am a fan of skills that are of use to many classes instead of just 1 or 2. That's my take on this report. But there is in fact a use for knowing when your poison has successfully afflicted your victim, tactically speaking ---on 6/7 @ 04:28 writes: I have to test once again, but I was under the impression that keeneye only says if the poison was delivered, not if it was successful in afflicting. (That is, not showing if it was shrugged). ---on 6/8 @ 07:18 writes: Report 826 does this ---on 6/10 @ 14:20 writes: If you're going to make statements like 'All abilities' - list them! Otherwise don't complain when we miss some... :p ---on 6/10 @ 22:42 writes: Uhm, I did in the first comment! I'm really sorry if it's not a comprehensive list but I'm moderately certain nothing is missing... ---on 6/12 @ 21:40 writes: You should probably also list the abilities separately by direct, passive, envenomed, and inherently poisonous. I support solution 3. ---on 6/13 @ 22:15 writes: To the best of my knowledge, these are the skills as split into those categories. Apologies for the spam and if there are any errors. Direct: Beastmastery Spit, Ecology Fetish, Telekinesis AnimateDagger, Transmology Claws, Stealth Blowgun, Nekotai Sprongcree, Nekotai ScorpionSpit, Shamanism Frogs // Passive: Cooking Sleep, Cooking Botulism, Cooking Death, Blacktalon Spiders, Tracking Spikepit, Tracking Darts, Ecology FamiliarSting // Envenomed: Ecology Fetish, Ecology FamiliarSting, Beastmastery Spit, Telekinesis AnimateDagger, Stealth Blowgun, Tracking Spikepit, Tracking Darts, Nekotai Sprongcree, Nekotai ScorpionSpit // Inherently Poisonous: Transmology Claws, Shamanism Frogs, Nihilism Barbedtail, Blacktalon Spiders. ---on 6/16 @ 15:56 writes: I see no need to expand keeneye beyond weapons or appendages that have to be envenomed to deliver poisons. ---on 6/17 @ 22:43 writes: I feel the same as Llandros that keeneye is not truly needed for classes that do not rely on poisons as a central mechanic for their offense. ---on 6/18 @ 08:26 writes: I agree that KeenEye should be helpful to classes who directly employ poisons in their offense. Solution 2. ---on 6/22 @ 15:42 writes: Yes, I'd like to see the KeenEye transfer/shrug message extended to all in-room, active abilities for poison classes. For Nekotai, that would include Sprongcree, ScorpionSpit, Blowgun Darts (in room). I understand the sentiment that it "is not truly needed for classes that do not reply on poisons..." Where does comment place Beast in regards of KeenEye support? ---on 6/26 @ 19:01 writes: Whilst I can see the argument that Keeneye was originally created for classes that rely on poisons as a central mechanic and should stay that way (though my opinion differs) - I would point out that poisons ARE part of the central mechanic for Ecology as an offense. Furthermore your argument would actually mean that some of the abilities I've listed above merit being given Keeneye messages, namely those used by warrior/monk guilds such as the Nekotai abilities. ---on 6/26 @ 20:12 writes: I don't agree with the beliefs of some envoys here that skills in general skillsets should only be useful to one or two classes. That's pretty pointless and isn't fun at all. It should be of some use to everyone. Under the logic of 'keeneye should only work on classes that make direct use of poisons', this can be technically understood as grounds for disqualifying beast spit, nekotai spit, ecology poisons, and a few other skills. That's not right simply because those same abilities are necessary for those classes in the right circumstances.